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Thread: First Clinical Trial proves what vapers already know

  1. #1
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    First Clinical Trial proves what vapers already know

    First-Ever Clinical Trial of Electronic Cigarettes Finds 13% One-Year Quit Rate Among Smokers with No Interest in Quitting

    The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary: First-Ever Clinical Trial of Electronic Cigarettes Finds 13% One-Year Quit Rate Among Smokers with No Interest in Quitting

    My favourite bit:
    It is difficult to compare these figures to those observed with NRT because NRT clinical trials involved smokers who wanted to quit. However, as I noted in a recent article, the 12-month smoking cessation rate for NRT in clinical trials with biochemical confirmation of smoking cessation is on the order of approximately 12%. Thus, electronic cigarettes in this trial performed about as well among non-motivated smokers as NRT performed among highly motivated smokers. Thus, this trial provides preliminary evidence that electronic cigarettes are more effective than traditional NRT treatment.

    The trial also used:
    1. Cigalikes (strike one) <-- this is wrong (see next post)
    2. Maximum 7.2Mg (strike two)

    Imagine what sort of results you would get from people who want to quit, plus better gear, plus higher nic rates. No wonder BP is shitting themselves right about now.
    Last edited by soundasleep; 27-06-13 at 03:51 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Correction: I would object however to the classification of e-cigarettes cartridges according to their total nicotine content. I find this inappropriate and I would classify them according to their nicotine concentration (which was 22.7mg/ml in one group and 17.1mg/ml in the other group).

    Efficacy of e-cigarette as a tobacco substitute-a randomized study
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  3. #3
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    "Some scientists criticised the study because of the high percent of participants lost to follow-up. Overall, 39% of participants were lost to follow up. This is a common phenomenon for smoking-cessation studies. Researchers analysed the results on an intention-to-treat basis, which means that they considered all people lost to follow-up as failures. This means that their analysis was performed according to the most pessimistic scenario; therefore, critics should read the paper more carefully before trying to underestimate the findings."

    When I read the article I didn't understand what "intention-to-treat" meant. This "39% of participants were lost to follow up............they considered all people lost to follow-up as failures" cleared that up nicely.

    It's rather interesting that they seemed to do everything they could to produce the lowest result possible. This means this study cannot be used to directly compare to other NRT clinical trials. Given this I'm not sure what their intention was with this study.
    Would it not have been more useful to conduct this trial under the same conditions as previous NRT trials? At least then we would have data to directly compare ecigs with pharmaceutical NRT products.
    Unless their intention was to create this as a direct comparison where ecigs were 'handicapped' knowing most media and political agendas will ignore or simply not realize the discrepancies in methodology.

    Cheers
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    Thank goodness for Dr Farsalinos for clearing up the fact about nicotine concentration. It's not like Prof Siegel to not pay attention to the details of a study.

    In any case, here is Dr Polosa himself talking about the study : Dr Polosa Discusses His Latest Quit Smoking E-Cigarette Study

    Here is the Italian brand of ecigs they used in the study ;



    It's a 3 piece 510 model (battery/atomizer/cartridge) much like the original one that Hon Lik first invented for Ruyan, and very similar to BAT's Intelicig. It's very out of date, so yes, I'm certain with a more updated ecig model results would have been much better.

    Hopefully these results don't give CatergoriaGroup an exclusive right to sell their ecig over other brands. I'm hoping that the whole industry can benefit from this. This company didn't pay for the study. They merely supplied part of equipment. This is the same case for PGM International's Elusion Ecig brand that is being used in the New Zealand study (pg 16).

    Translated to English at the bottom of Catergoria's page, it says

    "Electronic cigarettes category, in fact, maintain the aesthetics of traditional gestures and ensuring a unique pleasure" - which probably means they don't plan on changing that feature.

    This is just my opinion, but I don't really like the sound of that personally. I'm hoping that vaping will eventually attempt to disassociate itself from tobacco smoking completely one day. But then again, this is an Italian brand we're talking about.

    Personally, I'm waiting for the clinical trial that utilizes an eGo battery, bottom coil clearomizer and premixed ejuice. That would really shut the critics up once and for all. I'd predict a >90% quit rate in that kind of trial.
    Last edited by mavinry4; 27-06-13 at 12:21 PM. Reason: got the write translation

  5. #5
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    wow. they target people who have no intention of quitting. they give them crappy cigalikes. they give them stuff all nicotine. they count everyone lost to follow up as a failure. and still ecigs prove at least as effective as traditional nrt. i think that speaks absolute volumes
    lozza 82, Olfella and KamaKaZzie like this.



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  6. #6
    Noe
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    Add in some better gear in the next study & I bet the quit rates soar.
    Also do a study on smokers motivated to quit & the rates would soar again, we only need to look at our AVF new members/new vapers to see how many of them continue to vape & not smoke.

    The study looks to have been done to achieve the worst possible result, yet traditional NRT trials would have been done with the best possible result posted, clearly this study will have BIG Pharma shaking in their boots!
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundasleep View Post
    First-Ever Clinical Trial of Electronic Cigarettes Finds 13% One-Year Quit Rate Among Smokers with No Interest in Quitting

    The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary: First-Ever Clinical Trial of Electronic Cigarettes Finds 13% One-Year Quit Rate Among Smokers with No Interest in Quitting

    My favourite bit:
    It is difficult to compare these figures to those observed with NRT because NRT clinical trials involved smokers who wanted to quit. However, as I noted in a recent article, the 12-month smoking cessation rate for NRT in clinical trials with biochemical confirmation of smoking cessation is on the order of approximately 12%. Thus, electronic cigarettes in this trial performed about as well among non-motivated smokers as NRT performed among highly motivated smokers. Thus, this trial provides preliminary evidence that electronic cigarettes are more effective than traditional NRT treatment.

    The trial also used:
    1. Cigalikes (strike one) <-- this is wrong (see next post)
    2. Maximum 7.2Mg (strike two)

    Imagine what sort of results you would get from people who want to quit, plus better gear, plus higher nic rates. No wonder BP is shitting themselves right about now.
    i think this would be more accurate based on nubs smoking habits.

    - Non nicotine: 0 mg nicotine, which equivalents to No Nicotine.
    - Low density: 6 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Ultra Light Strength Cigarettes.
    - Medium density: 12 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Medium Strength Cigarettes.
    - High density: 18 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Regular Strength Cigarettes.
    - XHigh density: 24 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Strong Cigarettes.
    - XXHigh density: 36 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Very Strong Cigarettes.
    - XXXHigh density: 48 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Super Strong Cigarettes

    success rates would be alot higher imo.
    i did find this on un unspoken site aswell as this.
    if you inhale 1 ml of E-Liquid which contains 24 mg of nicotine, that does not mean that you absorb all the 24 mg of nicotine. You may only absorb about 40-65% of the nicotine according to your personal smoking habit.

    would this be acurate in vaping terms or is it unsubstantiated rubish to be ignored?? bare in mind i am a bit of a vape nub.

  8. #8
    Noe
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaper chris sa View Post
    i think this would be more accurate based on nubs smoking habits.

    - Non nicotine: 0 mg nicotine, which equivalents to No Nicotine.
    - Low density: 6 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Ultra Light Strength Cigarettes.
    - Medium density: 12 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Medium Strength Cigarettes.
    - High density: 18 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Regular Strength Cigarettes.
    - XHigh density: 24 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Strong Cigarettes.
    - XXHigh density: 36 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Very Strong Cigarettes.
    - XXXHigh density: 48 mg nicotine, which equivalents to Super Strong Cigarettes

    success rates would be alot higher imo.
    i did find this on un unspoken site aswell as this.
    if you inhale 1 ml of E-Liquid which contains 24 mg of nicotine, that does not mean that you absorb all the 24 mg of nicotine. You may only absorb about 40-65% of the nicotine according to your personal smoking habit.

    would this be acurate in vaping terms or is it unsubstantiated rubish to be ignored?? bare in mind i am a bit of a vape nub.
    First, we don't use the term "nub" or "nubs", it is a derogatory term, mostly used on gaming sites.
    Instead we use the friendly term newbie or newbies.

    To answer your question though, from what I have read, only about 1/3 of the nic in juice works to satisfy a vaper in the same way as the nic in an analog satisfies a smoker.
    The nic in analogs is "supercharged" by the addition of other chemicals, to deliver the dose in the most effective way, at high potency.
    vaper chris sa likes this.
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  9. #9
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    Plus one to the vapers in my eyes.

 

 

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