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  1. #1
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    What can I do with arctic fox?

    Well, my VTC mini finally did it, jumped out of TC mode and burnt the hell out of my lungs.

    If I use ArcticFox can I change this behavior. To just display a warning and not fire at all. For that matter can I change the length of time warnings are displayed so that I can read them. The VTC often fails to fire, I think there is a warning but I never see it.
    And another thing the VTC reports an open circuit as '0' ohms.

    This is turning into a list of things I'd like to change on the VTC. Will ArcticFox let me do this?



    Quote Originally Posted by fabricator4 View Post
    Arctic Fox firmware. This is Open Source (community driven) software that gives you the kind of control that you normally only get with Escribe on DNA devices.
    Fab, do you have the source code of ArcticFox? I can't seem to find it.
    I probably won't be able to make any sense of it, but I wouldn't mind wasting a few hours trying.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrix View Post
    Well, my VTC mini finally did it, jumped out of TC mode and burnt the hell out of my lungs.

    If I use ArcticFox can I change this behavior. To just display a warning and not fire at all. For that matter can I change the length of time warnings are displayed so that I can read them. The VTC often fails to fire, I think there is a warning but I never see it.
    And another thing the VTC reports an open circuit as '0' ohms.

    This is turning into a list of things I'd like to change on the VTC. Will ArcticFox let me do this?
    Yes, absolutely. There's an "auto mode" in one of the main sections. The software tries to determine which of the pre-programmed settings you need based on the matching the resistance of the coil to the set resistances. You would want to turn this off. I turned it off because many of my devices have similar resistances, and at certain ambient temperatures it was possible for it to get it wrong, apart from which, it sounds like you want to get away from "smart" coil selection. It only does autodetect when the coil is removed and re-attached, and you can change how sensitive the detection is (within 0.xx ohms kind of thing).

    I think it also defaults to show TCR errors, and this can be turned off. A TCR error will stop it firing, but only after the error has occurred (wrong wire setting should throw a TCR error).

    I run it with auto coil detection off, TCR error detection on, and the resistance locked for each profile. This means I have to change the resistance every time I change a coil, but since coils last me many months it's not a problem. My main profiles are "Subtank", "Kayfun", "NarDA", and "Power". It's possible to change and lock the resistance without plugging it into a computer, so even if you get caught out, it's not a problem anyway.


    Fab, do you have the source code of ArcticFox? I can't seem to find it.
    I probably won't be able to make any sense of it, but I wouldn't mind wasting a few hours trying.
    They seem to have changed the way they are doing this project. It used to be hosted on Github and the source code for NFE and Arctic Fox was available. I remember because I did briefly consider compiling a Linux version of the NFE tool but figured it would be more headaches than I wanted at that time.

    Since then they've moved to a forum based distribution and help system with no source code at all, which means it must now be distributed under a different license. One of the reasons is that I don't think they wrote the NFE code in a very portable way: certainly the Linux port that is available sounds like it is buggy and has lots of problems (predictably, USB problems and possibly a problem with the basic IO functions on the computer screen). That's what I kind of figured, and why I steered clear of it.

    When they took the NFE source code down from Github, of course the Arctic Fox firmware disappeared as well.

    I still highly recommend Arctic Fox, mostly because it allows you to fine tune the temperature control feedback for the type of coils you use, and yes you can stop it auto detecting the coil if you want. I left TCR error detection on - it doesn't trip unless there really is a problem, at least with the defaults.
    Last edited by fabricator4; 22-11-17 at 08:23 AM.
    Chris: Tobacco free since 17:00 15th March 2013.

  3. #3
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    Appears to be available here: https://nfeteam.org/

    ETA: sorry, no source code listed that I can see
    Ignore the Super-moderator tag in my profile, I have resigned from that position but admin have not updated my profile as yet

  4. #4
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    Github for the raw source code
    "Vapers- The evangelical vegans of the smoking community"
    Quote Originally Posted by btobw View Post
    1 vote for DogMan because squonkers, dogs, chooks and brevity

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by fabricator4 View Post
    I still highly recommend Arctic Fox, mostly because it allows you to fine tune the temperature control feedback for the type of coils you use,
    I'm not sure my coils are consistent enough to benefit from this. When I put the atomizer top on they seem to go to some universe where the laws of physics cease and they get mercilessly tortured, as evidenced by how distorted and brittle they are when I remove the top again.

    And I'm not interested in fancying the screen up. Except maybe a left to right swap, so I can vape in front of a mirror!! How vane we are!

    All I really need is to set: when this event happens take this action.
    Once the behavior is set, I shouldn't need to play with it again.

    I did briefly consider compiling a Linux version of the NFE tool but figured it would be more headaches than I wanted at that time.
    I think last time I thought about this I couldn't get the toolkit installed. I've got a windows machine, but NFE needed (dot)net?, but dotnet wouldn't install because of something else on the computer; and I couldn't really be bothered debugging windows.
    Last edited by mattrix; 22-11-17 at 02:34 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrix View Post
    I'm not sure my coils are consistent enough to benefit from this. When I put the atomizer top on they seem to go to some universe where the laws of physics cease and they get mercilessly tortured, as evidenced by how distorted and brittle they are when I remove the top again.

    And I'm not interested in fancying the screen up. Except maybe a left to right swap, so I can vape in front of a mirror!! How vane we are!

    All I really need is to set: when this event happens take this action.
    Once the behavior is set, I shouldn't need to play with it again.

    You don't have that kind of specific control. You can get it throw a TCR error if it thinks there is something really wrong, and it can select the profile depending on the resistance you screw on.

    You really do need a stable resistance if you are doing temp control though. If it's not rock solid it's going to give inconsistent results. Not all RTAs are suitable for temp control.

    I had trouble with a Kayfun 5 until I took the wire right around the screws (180 degrees) and tightened it down hard. It's been stable since, I think it might be the same coil.

    Next is any other contacts in the build deck (removable RBA contacts for eg) which much be completely clean. After that you've got the 510 contacts on the tank and the mod. They need cleaning, and if the airflow is separate (like on anything designed in the last 3 years) then you can use a bit of carbon grease like R006 on the contacts. You then put the cold tank on the mod, and read and set the resistance.

    If the resistance wobbles around for no reason you can't use it for TC. even 0.04 variation can cause you a problem. You want set and forget, and for that you need a stable resistance.

    Fine tuning the feedback (called PI reg in the software) is more about getting a consistent vape and getting it to maintain and hold a set temperature. I found the defaults for the Evic VTC mini and the firefox software itself to constantly over correct, so I really like being able to find tune it.
    Chris: Tobacco free since 17:00 15th March 2013.

  7. #7
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    You don't have that kind of specific control.
    Oh, What is ArcticFox's behavior when it thinks you shouldn't be in TC?
    Does it ever change modes by itself?
    Still not sure why the VTC threw me out.

    Fine tuning the feedback (called PI reg in the software) is more about getting a consistent vape and getting it to maintain and hold a set temperature. I found the defaults for the Evic VTC mini and the firefox software itself to constantly over correct, so I really like being able to find tune it.
    Maybe I should have said I'm too inconsistent, I wouldn't notice the subleties of 'fine tuning'. I find each me/coil/wick combination is different.


    With TC wire in TC mode, its difficult to tell what the coil is doing. Is a change in R due to temperature or a bad connection? And of course, in TC mode the VTC only displays the locked resistance, actually it doesn't seem to update the resistance very often in power mode either.

    Having said that, I do find my coils need some vaping before they settle. And the resistance increases as they age.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrix View Post
    Oh, What is ArcticFox's behavior when it thinks you shouldn't be in TC?
    Does it ever change modes by itself?
    Still not sure why the VTC threw me out.
    Usually, if the resistance change is not consistent with the TCR setting a VTC will drop back to power mode. Arctic Fox can be set to throw a TCR error (setting is enable or ignore TCR error, I think you can also adjust % error that will cause an error condition)


    Maybe I should have said I'm too inconsistent, I wouldn't notice the subleties of 'fine tuning'. I find each me/coil/wick combination is different.
    It shouldn't be. If you build the same style of coil and roughly the same resistance, if TC is running correctly and the resistance in the mod is correct, you can't tell the difference at all. You can tell if it's wicking right though - when the vapour drops off your tank is empty or your coil is clagged up. It never burns.

    Running arctic fox on the mod, and using the analysis tools in NFE, you should be able to see what is going on - either variations in resistance that are not compatible with normal use, or a failure to maintain the correct temperature, which is PI Reg feedback, or insufficient maximum wattage set (as in too low).

    With TC wire in TC mode, its difficult to tell what the coil is doing. Is a change in R due to temperature or a bad connection? And of course, in TC mode the VTC only displays the locked resistance, actually it doesn't seem to update the resistance very often in power mode either.
    Arctic Fox shows two resistances - the locked resistance, and the current resistance to three decimal places. The third place floats around a lot, but the second place shouldn't vary much except with the coil is cooling down or heating up. Mine at them moment is going from 0.385 to 0.445 from room temp to vaping at 205C

    Using the NFE tool you can graph the temperature and resistance while you are vaping - that's how I fine tuned PI Reg.

    Having said that, I do find my coils need some vaping before they settle. And the resistance increases as they age.
    The most common reason for that, if it's a straight change from low to high is that you are using contact coils. As the coils age the resistance between wraps increases. I'd only advise using spaced coils for TC.

    If that's not it, then there's some bad connection somewhere. My coils don't change from one month to the next, though I do sometimes need to clean the 510 and check it over generally.
    Last edited by fabricator4; 23-11-17 at 02:56 PM.
    Chris: Tobacco free since 17:00 15th March 2013.

 

 

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