Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 19 of 19
Like Tree22Likes

Thread: Dry burning coils in rdas

  1. #11
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Darlinghurst, Sydney
    Posts
    4,748
    Havent dry burnt a coil in like 2 years.
    Also once the coil gets beyond light brown, i rip it out and build a new one.
    Temp control works best this way too, new coil or at least non-gunky coil
    emu and Sully like this.
    Stylemessiah: Prince of all things small and whispery. Abhorrer of shoutiness. Shunner of all vigorousities.

    Not on as many ignore lists as you think....

    Handy shopping links:
    Mods With Issues (Often On Discounted Flash Sale) Last Updated 13/10/17

  2. #12
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    State of Insanity - NSW
    Posts
    915
    TC is something I havent tried with RDAs (currently playing with Tsunami / Pulse/ and Dead Rabbit)
    Is there a suggested range to start with TC? Obviously Im guessing that it has to be on a TC compatible reg mod too!
    Can I ask what material your coils are Style' cos you vape unflav vg dont you from memory?
    One failed lab experiment away from obtaining superpowers

    https://media.tenor.co/images/860c5d...011a/tenor.gif

  3. #13
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Darlinghurst, Sydney
    Posts
    4,748
    Quote Originally Posted by Sully View Post
    TC is something I havent tried with RDAs (currently playing with Tsunami / Pulse/ and Dead Rabbit)
    Is there a suggested range to start with TC? Obviously Im guessing that it has to be on a TC compatible reg mod too!
    Can I ask what material your coils are Style' cos you vape unflav vg dont you from memory?
    Range:

    If you mean temp - i vape low temp 175c-185c on the TreeBox, though im at 195c on the ePetite (due to the different way DNA works - refining (coil resistance reading changing over time due to outside temps)) - near equivalent vape on both

    If you mean coil resistance - on a single coil (with 316SS) i always advise starting out, for the best results building at 0.5 or above (due to 316's low TCR - building to the wires quirks). Does this mean you cant build lower? No, but you'd be surprised how many times ive seen people on ECF bang on about how "temp control sucks" and "temp control doesnt work", and ive posted "build 0.5 or above for a single coil" and theyve changed tack. I know people who build lower and have sucess, but thats due to the other factors like the quality of the chip and the TCR they have set. As noted above, my TreeBox gives me still the best TC vape ive ever found, hands down, using its high sampling chip and its also using a set TCR (0.00092 (from DJLSB's recommendations and testing) - Fab sometimes uses or advises slightly higher (again depending on mod, he uses Joyetech gear). The TreeBox is set and forget. The DNA in my ePetite uses a TCR curve rather than a simple static TCR number, so it works differently...it also refines the atty resistance up and down due to its algorythm and outside temp, and that annoys me (though less as time goes by) though ive never locked resistance on it to curb this annoyance, so i do occasionally bump up the temp on it to compensate and achieve the vape i had previously (sometimes an hour before). Dual coils i think you can manage to run lower as theres more wire mass, despite the low TCR of the wire, but dont quote me on this

    Material:

    I started tc on nickel (would never use it now), then skipped titanium, and went straight to 316 SS, where ive been for eons. Ive had side trips to try out 430ss - higher TCR, supposedly more accurate, but i could never get a reliable starting TCR from any of the wire manufacturers i trialled wire from, and Lauries own tests showed that the TCR for it was like stabbing rats in the dark - he may still use it, i gave it away, i dont like manufacturers saying things like "try this setting", or "ive heard this is the setting". Mind you i tried that and it was like i said stabbing rats in the dark, so much variance. i like definites. So back to 316 SS, its been my mainstay for eons, its stable at the accepted TCR and no variance in that the entire time ive used it.

    So wire type, coil resistance, mod TCR setting if its a simple TCR setting mod or appropriate CSV file from Steam engine (if its not already in your materials list in the mod or in escribe) on DNA based chips and a temp above 185c...i know it sounds like a lot of considerations compared to VW mode vaping, but factor in that once you settle into the wire type, and set the TCR/curve setting on your mod theyre set and forget, and its back one setting you may change, the temp....

    The only time im ever back on VW mode is on the extremely rare occasion im at steamers and trying out a flavour on their test tanks...


    p.s. Yep, unflavoured 99.9% of the time (now on a 70%PG/30%VG mix at the moment - my high VG mixes got a bit much during winter - heavy chest feeling), although im thinking about filtering the anise/fennel in PG mix ive had in a bottle for months this week and seeign if i can achieve my holy grail anise vape
    Last edited by stylemessiah; 08-11-17 at 06:05 PM.
    Sully likes this.
    Stylemessiah: Prince of all things small and whispery. Abhorrer of shoutiness. Shunner of all vigorousities.

    Not on as many ignore lists as you think....

    Handy shopping links:
    Mods With Issues (Often On Discounted Flash Sale) Last Updated 13/10/17

  4. #14
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    State of Insanity - NSW
    Posts
    915
    thanks heaps Style that was exactly the info I was after, even after my vague question!
    Im pretty sure the RXMini (Realeaux) and the Cuboid (big black thingy 150w?) can do TC sure Ive got some other mod that has this, its something Ive wanted to trial for ages but never got around to asking.
    I know I have 316SS in that 5 roll UD box of wire I have, Ill give it a shot,
    thanks again really appreciate the detailed info!
    cheers mate!
    stylemessiah likes this.
    One failed lab experiment away from obtaining superpowers

    https://media.tenor.co/images/860c5d...011a/tenor.gif

  5. #15
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Darlinghurst, Sydney
    Posts
    4,748
    Quote Originally Posted by Sully View Post
    thanks heaps Style that was exactly the info I was after, even after my vague question!
    Im pretty sure the RXMini (Realeaux) and the Cuboid (big black thingy 150w?) can do TC sure Ive got some other mod that has this, its something Ive wanted to trial for ages but never got around to asking.
    I know I have 316SS in that 5 roll UD box of wire I have, Ill give it a shot,
    thanks again really appreciate the detailed info!
    cheers mate!
    I did forget the other thing that you have to set (i was on my way out earlier)...the watts mode...in tc mode most mods will still have a watts setting - just to confuse you some mods let you make the watts setting as part of the tc mode, others you have to set first and then change to tc mode and set temp - my TreeBox does this...set the watts, then change to tc mode and set temp (i havent been in there since i bought it and set the watts ceiling at 50w)

    The watts setting is universal, whether its a normal tc mod or DNA, theres a watts setting component.

    In tc mode, the watts setting is a ceiling (not a fixed application of watts), i.e. if you set 60 watts, thats the maximum it will use to try and hit the temp you set, or flipside and more to the point it will only use as many watts out of the watts ceiling to hit the temp. Conversely If its set too low, you may never hit the set temp. Most manufacturers will advise setting watts above 30 for starters. I set mine at 50, as its not a setting i want to revisit if i ever go to a higher temp.

    Practical example:

    Watts setting (ceiling): 50 watts
    Temp setting: 185c

    Watts actually used -
    Initial firing (to get to temp): 28w
    During vape (after initial fire and to maintain temp): 17w

    The above really highlights for people trying to get their head around tc what the difference is over watts mode - the mod will only use what it needs to hit and maintain a set temp versus watts mode where the mod fires at the watts set, and the coil just keeps heating up as long as you fire it....

    Also worth pointing out, in the (now) unlikely event your mod ever drops out of tc mode, then it will revert to the set watts...i.e. the set watts will be what the mod will flood your lungs with vapour at. Ive never had a mod drop out of tc and its less likely these days. It used to happen on JoyeTech gear back in the early days of their foray into tc. KangerTech also had a period of this too.

    If you are overly cautious re the possible drop out of course, you can set your watts high 50+, set the temp and monitor the watts used durign initial fire and then set the watts to that + 10 or more watts above for a little headroom if you up your temps

    For me at least, on my temps, i will hardly be needing to ever change the watts setting, and the reliability of the mod means im not worried about dragons breath if it drops out of tc mode.

    Hope that makes sense.
    Last edited by stylemessiah; 08-11-17 at 06:24 PM.
    emu and Sully like this.
    Stylemessiah: Prince of all things small and whispery. Abhorrer of shoutiness. Shunner of all vigorousities.

    Not on as many ignore lists as you think....

    Handy shopping links:
    Mods With Issues (Often On Discounted Flash Sale) Last Updated 13/10/17

  6. #16
    emu
    emu is online now
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    West Australia
    Posts
    1,897
    The Vaporesso Revenger has an excellent TC mode, best I've used ever. I've got a low ohm ss build on it with the watt's set to 80 and temp is on CCT so it starts at 200 and works it's way up to 220 over 5 seconds, I also lock the resistance when it's cold. The vape is so consistent and this thing never drops out, much better than the eleaf temp control.

    Sent from my GO11A using Tapatalk
    stylemessiah likes this.

  7. #17
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Central Coast, NSW
    Posts
    991
    Yaaaaaaaaaay this is a TC thread now!

    NEVER dry burn or run Ni200 (Ni200 is NOT Nichrome, btw - I see the similar names confuse people all the time) or Titanium outside of temp control. They can give off nasty oxides. They're also outdated wires in that there are far better options out there now - the only real reason to use either one is if you're doing a build you intend to run on an old temp control device that doesn't support anything newer (like an iStick 40W TC or something).

    Personally, I also avoid dry burning other materials too. It's potentially unhealthy, you never get ALL the grot off, and frankly - spools of wire are cheap, and it's just more pleasant to rebuild / rewick a totally clean and dry atty rather than trying to wash and work around some scungy looking black coils.

    Stainless Steel variants are by far the most popular wire to work with now (though I prefer NiFe30 for TC, personally). Make a spaced coil (wraps NOT touching) with some stainless steel, throw your mod into whatever stainless steel TC mode matches your wire (most common - SS316L) and have at it!

    You can use RDAs with Temp Control - it's absolutely a thing! I do it myself - particularly with big honking heavy Clapton coils and such. Temp control allows you to absolutely crank up the wattage and eliminate "ramp up" time, while stopping things from getting too hot while you're actually vaping.

    Be aware though - some attys work better than others. TC demands electrical stability and firm leg capturing, and some attys just aren't cut out for it. If your atty doesn't capture wire firmly, if the coil legs are too long (common problem with a lot of postless decks), or if any of the electrical connections in the base are kinda loosey goosey (a bigger problem with older stuff), you might not have such a fun time. That said, most modern attys are fine.

    Starting out with TC - I like to use a car analogy. Think of wattage as your accelerator, your set temperature as the speed limit, and the mass of your coil (as in, is it one thin wire, or a big honking clapton? Single or multiple coils?) as the weight of your vehicle.

    Start off with your wattage similar to what you'd use for a non-TC build of the same type (just in case TC doesn't work for some reason - this prevents a nasty dry hit / burning wick situation). If your coils are taking too long to ramp up - increase your wattage.
    Having too high a wattage isn't a big issue in temp control (as long as temp control is working!) as your mod will drop the wattage on it's own - you really just need to set it high enough to get your coils up to temperature quickly.

    Start off with your temp on the low side - you'll get a feel of what sort of temperatures you like with experience, but it's better to get a mouthful of vapour that's too cool than too hot. If the vape is feeling too cold (and your air flow is fine) - increase your temperature. If the vape is feeling too hot, or you're getting any burning (particularly when things are a bit dry) - decrease your temperature.

    Practical examples -

    I build my SQuape [E]motion with one single strand 28awg 7 wrap 2.5mm ID coil. Thin wire, only one coil, fairly small sized.... so it doesn't need a lot of wattage behind it to get it up to temperature quickly. So I usually set my wattage at around 30W for that.

    For my SQuape [X]s though - I know I like that with dual coils. Still 28awg, 2.5mm ID 7 wrap as above - but two of them. Dual coils take a bit more punch to get up to temperature instantly - so I might crank the wattage up to around 50W.

    If I'm putting a big, 4mm ID, 26/32 awg dual claptons in something like a Goon though - I'm going to set the wattage to something a good deal higher! Something like that, I'd probably kick off with about 80W.

    From experience I know I like temperatures around 220 - 240 degrees C. So, I usually start off around 190 - 200 degrees C, and work my way up over the course of a few puffs. This is to get a fresh build settled in - sometimes your coil resistance can fluctuate a tiny bit on the first few puffs, and it makes sure your wick is totally primed all the way through.

    Here's a screengrab from my Escribe Device Monitor. I'm running my SQuape [E]motion on my good ol' Hotcig DR200 DNA 200.



    The flat red and green lines are my set temperature (210 deg C) and set wattage (33W) respectively. The wavy red and green lines are - as you probably can guess - the real time temperature during the puffs, and applied wattages during the puffs.

    On the first puff, the coil is cold. I have the allowable pre-heat punch set to 55W, so it's whacking the coil with everything to get it up to temperature as fast as possible. Once the coil got to temperature, the mod dropped the wattage (and fiddled with it) to maintain the temperature as close as possible to my setting.

    On puff two, you can see that since the coil was still warm, the mod didn't throw as much wattage at it to get it up to temperature.

    On puff three, you can see the same thing (particularly the higher starting temperature of the coil) - but I also did an interesting thing. About 1/3 of the way through the puff, I decided to randomly suck harder and pass a whole lot more air over the coil. This cooled the coil, and you can see the mod increased the applied wattage to compensate. Then you can see where I start running out of lung space, and back off - and the mod backs the wattage off as the amount of air going over the coil decreases.

    That little bump in the 3rd puff is actually me finding out I'm out of lung space, and exhaling a tiny bit through the atty .

    Contrast to this -

    Exact same atty, mod, and temperature settings - the only difference is that I've lowered the wattage to 15W. You can see from my first few puffs that my mod is usually only hitting my atty with around 15 - 17W for most of my puff, so what's setting a max of 15W going to do?



    Drastic change! It's trying really hard to get the coil up to temperature - but the very short duration I've set for the preheat punch can't do it. With a maximum wattage of 15W, the ramp up time is LOOOOOONG! In fact, with a normal strength puff I couldn't get it up to 210 degrees at all - I had to puff only very, very lightly. The mod is riding right on the wattage limit I've set (15W) and it barely maintaining the set temperature. Drawing any harder would cause the temperature to drop, as the very low wattage limit wouldn't allow the mod to compensate for the increased airflow.

    And that's how wattage relates to temperature control. What that has to do with dry burning coils in RDAs? Ha ha ha... oops, sorry . I got sidetracked.
    These things.

    I have some things.
    I vape them.

  8. #18
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Where the spectre of Bjelke-Petersen still looms...A Banana Republic inside a Banana Republic
    Posts
    2,018
    I saw something recently that recommended not heating SS beyond an orange glow, but that may just have been more alarmist crap....
    Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.

    Quality Australian Made eJuice: Bunyip Vapes



  9. #19
    AVF Regular
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Darlinghurst, Sydney
    Posts
    4,748
    There's something to be said for simple single wire single spaced coil for tc over the wankery of Clapton's etc, as I said earlier, i haven't dry fired a coil in eons...wrap coil, fit coil, wick coil, fill tank, fire it. None of that tweezering malarkey. Life is simple, life is good.

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
    rockmoose likes this.
    Stylemessiah: Prince of all things small and whispery. Abhorrer of shoutiness. Shunner of all vigorousities.

    Not on as many ignore lists as you think....

    Handy shopping links:
    Mods With Issues (Often On Discounted Flash Sale) Last Updated 13/10/17

 

 
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.4
Copyright © 2017 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
All times are GMT +11. The time now is 08:21 PM.