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Thread: Researchers (not the Gartner group) Queensland comment on e-cigarettes

  1. #1
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    Researchers (not the Gartner group) Queensland comment on e-cigarettes

    February 1, 2014

    http://download.thelancet.com/pdfs/j...361460146X.pdf

    We are concerned about how the medical community should interpret the findings of Christopher Bullen and colleagues’ trial of e-cigarettes as an aid to smoking cessation. Setting aside momentarily the questionable role of tobacco giants in evidence generation, we wonder if the authors are over-interpretating their results. Opening their discussion, they assert that e-cigarette use resulted in increased smoking abstinence at 6 months, before
    conceding that the observed difference was not statistically significant.

    They go on to outline statistically insignificant trends in secondary outcome measures favouring the nicotine e-cigarette group as further support for the apparent superiority of e-cigarettes. By contrast, a statistically insignificant increase in adverse events in the nicotine e-cigarettes group is glossed over as “no difference” to nicotine patches. In view of the evident lack of benefit, it is concerning to note that 38% of those who stopped smoking in the nicotine e-cigarette group continued using e-cigarettes, and 29% of the ongoing smokers were potentially supplementing traditional cigarettes with e-cigarettes. This finding might be good news for tobacco companies developing markets, but not for global public health.

    In that context it is appropriate to recall that evidence shows that most (54–69%) smokers quit without pharmacological aids. In view of
    the costs of pharmacological aids, particularly for developing countries, we propose prioritising investment in investigating approaches which can be delivered globally.
    Christopher Doyle,
    Susan Patterson,
    *James Scott
    james_g_scott@health.qld.gov.au
    Metro North Mental Health, Royal Brisbane and
    Women’s Hospital, Brisbane 4029, QLD, Australia
    (CD, SP, JS); and University of Queensland Centre for
    Clinical Research, Brisbane, QLD, Australia (JS


    My commentary to this:


    1. They seem to be under the misconception that the e-cigarette industry is in the clutches of the tobacco cigarette industry.

    Whilst Big Tobacco corporations can afford marketing, surveys show that 98% of of vapers dont use Big Tobacco vaping products.

    2. They appear to think that the e-cigarettes used in the Lancet study is the final conclusion about e-ciig efficacy. They have completely ignored the researchers in Europe such as Lynne Dawkins, Dr Farsilinos and Doctor Robert West who have acknowledged that the devices that the majority of vapers are using (i.e 2nd and 3rd Gen devices), which are vastly different to the ones used in the clinical trial, may prove to be far more efficient in delivering nicotine and physical sensations that helps in smoking cessation.


    3. They want a tobacco cessation method that is accessible globally, which I assume they mean; also in developing countries where people don't have access to electricity and can't charge e-cigarette batteries. I find that approach extraordinary. Almost as though; "If the poorest countries aren't able to quit smoking with e-cigarettes, then neither should the more developed countries who have easy access to electricity".


    Other authors in that paper are clearly prohibitionists.
    Last edited by mavinry4; 02-02-14 at 01:24 AM.
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  2. #2
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    and 29% of the ongoing smokers were potentially supplementing traditional cigarettes with e-cigarettes
    What the hell does that even mean ?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by banger View Post
    What the hell does that even mean ?
    Dual Use.

    These guys are definitely in communication with Simeon Chirpman. This is the kind of stuff he preaches.

    Using the Lancet study to say that e-cigarettes may be as good as patches, but, that benefit is negated by the fact that they mimic smoking behavior unlike patches, and therefore are of no net benefit to society. That they should be banned or heavily restricted.

    They base this proposal for public policy on the study of a F**king cigalike, whilst ignoring 2nd and 3rd gen ecigs potential, meanwhile promoting the cold turkey, quit or die method.
    Last edited by mavinry4; 02-02-14 at 01:42 AM.

  4. #4
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    It reads to me that "29% of the ongoing smokers were may be supplementing traditional cigarettes with e-cigarettes but we don't know , but potentially they are so we'll just say it and you'll believe it , but really if we're asked we can point out that it's only potentially."

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by banger View Post
    What the hell does that even mean ?
    "potentially" = Feelpinion based on crap sample questions. It's obvious they don't have any understanding of what they are studying.
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    ]6⁹.12[

  6. #6
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    In view of the evident lack of benefit, it is concerning to note that 38% of those who stopped smoking in the nicotine e-cigarette group continued using e-cigarettes, and 29% of the ongoing smokers were potentially supplementing traditional cigarettes with e-cigarettes.
    So then....

    Of the people in the nicotine ecig group that stopped smoking -

    62% stopped smoking AND stopped vaping - completely cutting their dependance on nicotine.

    38% of people in the same group went ecigs-only - stopping smoking entirely.


    Of the people that continued to smoke -

    29% may have substituted some of their cigarette usage for some ecig usage.

    Dude says these figures like they're a bad thing.

    Attach electrodes to people like that and we wouldn't need wind farms .
    Last edited by Fractal; 02-02-14 at 02:33 AM.
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    These things.

    I have some things.
    I vape them.

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    New Zealand study ( Sept 2013)
    http://download.thelancet.com/flatco...3613618425.pdf

    Quote

    Interpretation
    E-cigarettes, with or without nicotine, were modestly effective at helping smokers to quit, with similar achievement of abstinence as with nicotine patches, and few adverse events. Uncertainty exists about the place of e-cigarettes in tobacco control, and more research is urgently needed to clearly establish their overall benefits and harms at both individual and population levels

    Procedures
    Elusion e-cigarettes are among the e-cigarette market leaders in Australasia; in New Zealand, nicotine e-cigarettes are not permitted to be sold, but nicotine-free e-cigarettes are widely available for sale and identical in appearance to nicotine versions. We commissioned analyses of these
    e-cigarettes: the liquid was free of diethylene glycol (a toxin detected in fluid in one brand of e-cigarettes 10); nicotine
    cartridges (labelled 16 mg) contained 10–16 mg nicotine per mL;

    Unquote


    My interpretation

    (Note Generation 1 e-cigs were used with cartomisers with 10-16mg nicotine which may account for the poor success rate in this trial)
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by margyb View Post
    New Zealand study ( Sept 2013)
    http://download.thelancet.com/flatco...3613618425.pdf

    Quote

    Interpretation
    E-cigarettes, with or without nicotine, were modestly effective at helping smokers to quit, with similar achievement of abstinence as with nicotine patches, and few adverse events. Uncertainty exists about the place of e-cigarettes in tobacco control, and more research is urgently needed to clearly establish their overall benefits and harms at both individual and population levels

    Procedures
    Elusion e-cigarettes are among the e-cigarette market leaders in Australasia; in New Zealand, nicotine e-cigarettes are not permitted to be sold, but nicotine-free e-cigarettes are widely available for sale and identical in appearance to nicotine versions. We commissioned analyses of these
    e-cigarettes: the liquid was free of diethylene glycol (a toxin detected in fluid in one brand of e-cigarettes 10); nicotine
    cartridges (labelled 16 mg) contained 1016 mg nicotine per mL;

    Unquote


    My interpretation

    (Note Generation 1 e-cigs were used with cartomisers with 10-16mg nicotine which may account for the poor success rate in this trial)
    Which is why I'd like to thank everyone that contacted the Gartner group and letting them know that the ecigs they use are vastly different to the medium nicotine-level cigalikes used in the Lancet study.

    This led to 2nd and 3rd gen ecigs being acknowledged in the questionaire, and hopefully, hopefully, they consider using 2nd or 3rd gen ecigs in the 2015 clinical trial, and nicotine concentrations between 18 and 24mg/mL.
    margyb, spud and maggie like this.

 

 

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