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Thread: ... and so it begins

  1. #1
    AVF Newbie | Be nice to me
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    ... and so it begins

    Hey All,

    No real questions, not ready for a "my story" post, just a few things to share I guess. Insights welcome of course.

    Probably a story for another time but I've struggled a lot with a very strong intolerance to PG. Unable to identify the problem for ages because the symptoms (for me) were exactly the same as too much nic.

    Good news though, I've been vaping pure VG (with VG based nic, few drops of water) for the last few days with very few unpleasant side effects. It's a truly elating feeling because for the first time in forever I can see a pathway to leaving the coffin nails behind for good.

    For this week the plan is to halve the cigarette intake while I get used to vaping, get a feel for how much is enough, etc. I did just read this post which wisely cautions against a "cutting down" approach. But I feel like I'm heavily motivated to quit for good, so a week or so of getting into the swing of things doesn't seem like such a bad idea.

    That said, I've definitely learned that vaping doesn't quite scratch the itch. Like I don't get the full on panic feeling that accompanies quitting with no replacement.. it's just a weird uncomfortable restless feeling. Obviously there's an urge to have a few hits from the vape when I feel like a cigarette, but the fact is I already have too much nic in my system so I'm feeling the effects of too much nic, as well as not enough whatever-else-is-in-cigarettes. So I guess the goal for today is to try to strike the right balance, just enough of the vape without overdoing it.

    Kind of an aside but I just read the post about inhalation techniques and I'm a bit surprised that 4 to 8 seconds is recommended. I'm using an innokin T18, I reckon after 3 or 4 seconds the mouth piece gets hot enough to burn my lips. (not BURN kind of burn.. just unpleasantly hot). Maybe I'm drawing too hard, maybe it's to do with the pure VG liquid. I'll try a softer draw, maybe read up on this later when I have time.
    ybnice likes this.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr5o1 View Post
    Probably a story for another time but I've struggled a lot with a very strong intolerance to PG. Unable to identify the problem for ages because the symptoms (for me) were exactly the same as too much nic.
    Yes, PG intolerance is surprisingly common, and possibly one reason why vaping fails for some people who don't have experienced vapers to learn from. It's good that you've been able to identify the problem and fix it. Actually, that's great news!

    For this week the plan is to halve the cigarette intake while I get used to vaping, get a feel for how much is enough, etc. I did just read this post which wisely cautions against a "cutting down" approach. But I feel like I'm heavily motivated to quit for good, so a week or so of getting into the swing of things doesn't seem like such a bad idea.
    Actually everyone is different. I gave up smoking the day my first cigalike arrived. I WAS pretty determined to give it a damn good go though - it wasn't always easy, especially when the thing broke after one week of use due to me refilling cartos and getting juice inside the auto switch. Many people find it far easier than they expected, so just take it easy and do what seems right for you.

    That said, I've definitely learned that vaping doesn't quite scratch the itch. Like I don't get the full on panic feeling that accompanies quitting with no replacement.. it's just a weird uncomfortable restless feeling. Obviously there's an urge to have a few hits from the vape when I feel like a cigarette, but the fact is I already have too much nic in my system so I'm feeling the effects of too much nic, as well as not enough whatever-else-is-in-cigarettes. So I guess the goal for today is to try to strike the right balance, just enough of the vape without overdoing it.
    Yes, I can relate to how you are feeling, very much. It's a little early in your path for WTA withdrawals though, so I think the problem is you are not quite getting the instant "hit" that your brain needs to feel satisfied. It's that "Ahhhh" moment when the nicotine does what it is supposed to. How you get there depends on you, the device you are using, and your nicotine content, so what nicotine strength have you got?. For a MTL (mouth to lung) device like the T18 you might need 12mg/ml, 18mg/ml, or even 24mg/ml if you are heavily dependent. We are all different remember - there's no wrong way.

    I can tell you though that it's possible to overdose on lower concentrations of nicotine and not get the "Ahhhh" moment, leaving you feeling that you are missing something. Higher nicotine means you do have to vape less, but if it's working for you then you will be perfectly fine with that. We tend to find what works over time.

    100% VG liquids also do not have much throat hit, and it's surprising how important that is for many people. It's kind of like a tight, hard, thump at the back of the throat that seems to cue the brain into the right response. Nicotine can certainly help with that too, more than anything else in the absence of PG. Throat hit is something we never think about when we smoked, but the absence of it when we vape is missed very much by some vapers.

    Another trick that really works for me is nose exhales. The vapourised nicotine we use is not absorbed in the lungs very well, so the nicotine rush is too slow. If you blow it out your nose the nicotine is more readily absorbed in the nasal passages, with a blood supply that goes straight to where it is needed. It's a Bingo! moment for many people. I also enjoy the "nose hit" which you won't hear many vapers talk about. It's a tightness that goes all the way back to the back of your head and will make you sneeze until you get used to it. (also runny nose, have a tissue handy). The sensation I can relate it to the most is using dry snuff, back when you could buy it in Australia.

    If you still have problems even with this advice there other things you can try, but definitely try to dial in your ideal nicotine strength first.

    Kind of an aside but I just read the post about inhalation techniques and I'm a bit surprised that 4 to 8 seconds is recommended.
    That ECF post was written in 2012. The technology five years ago was WAY different to what we use now. If you could transport your T18 back to that era the concept of it would blow people's minds, both in terms of the wattage used, and the evolution of airflow.

    I find with my devices, often 1.8 seconds are sufficient, or if it's an RDA with a big coil, four seconds maximum.
    Last edited by fabricator4; 11-10-17 at 11:38 AM. Reason: grammar edit
    Chris: Tobacco free since 17:00 15th March 2013.

  3. #3
    AVF Newbie | Be nice to me
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    Yes, I can relate to how you are feeling, very much. It's a little early in your path for WTA withdrawals though, so I think the problem is you are not quite getting the instant "hit" that your brain needs to feel satisfied. It's that "Ahhhh" moment when the nicotine does what it is supposed to. How you get there depends on you, the device you are using, and your nicotine content, so what nicotine strength have you got?. For a MTL (mouth to lung) device like the T18 you might need 12mg/ml, 18mg/ml, or even 24mg/ml if you are heavily dependent. We are all different remember - there's no wrong way.

    I can tell you though that it's possible to overdose on lower concentrations of nicotine and not get the "Ahhhh" moment, leaving you feeling that you are missing something. Higher nicotine means you do have to vape less, but if it's working for you then you will be perfectly fine with that. We tend to find what works over time.
    This is really useful information. I've been smoking rollies for the last decade or so, thinking about it now I get the same awkward uncomfortable feeling when I have to smoke tailor made's for a few days. Having read this I realise now that it's about getting a "hit" rather than just getting enough.

    100% VG liquids also do not have much throat hit, and it's surprising how important that is for many people. It's kind of like a tight, hard, thump at the back of the throat that seems to cue the brain into the right response. Nicotine can certainly help with that too, more than anything else in the absence of PG. Throat hit is something we never think about when we smoked, but the absence of it when we vape is missed very much by some vapers.
    I'm running 18mg nic, honestly the throat hit seems satisfactory, like a 3 to 4 second draw hits my throat pretty good. Any more and I'd cough. Given the above I might switch up to 24mg just to see how that goes.

    Another trick that really works for me is nose exhales. The vapourised nicotine we use is not absorbed in the lungs very well, so the nicotine rush is too slow. If you blow it out your nose the nicotine is more readily absorbed in the nasal passages, with a blood supply that goes straight to where it is needed. It's a Bingo! moment for many people. I also enjoy the "nose hit" which you won't hear many vapers talk about. It's a tightness that goes all the way back to the back of your head and will make you sneeze until you get used to it. (also runny nose, have a tissue handy). The sensation I can relate it to the most is using dry snuff, back when you could buy it in Australia.
    Super keen to give this a shot. Thanks.

    That ECF post was written in 2012. The technology five years ago was WAY different to what we use now. If you could transport your T18 back to that era the concept of it would blow people's minds, both in terms of the wattage used, and the evolution of airflow.

    I find with my devices, often 1.8 seconds are sufficient, or if it's an RDA with a big coil, four seconds maximum.
    This is really good to know. I had no idea. I tried a 5 second draw earlier and it was... unpleasant.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr5o1 View Post
    For this week the plan is to halve the cigarette intake while I get used to vaping, get a feel for how much is enough, etc. I did just read this post which wisely cautions against a "cutting down" approach. But I feel like I'm heavily motivated to quit for good, so a week or so of getting into the swing of things doesn't seem like such a bad idea.
    Dont be afraid to use ecigs to cut down gradually but make sure if you do it you have both and try and use the ecig more than cigs.
    I can remember the week when I started vaping. I bought my usual weekly carton of cigs on a sunday. On the following monday my first ever nic juice arrived and on tuesday my ego style kit arrived. I used both for a week but found I was using the ego more and more then after a week I was out in the car and didnt take the ego so bought a pack of cigs lit one up and thought these taste like crap! That was the turning point I have never touched a cig in over 2 1/2 years and still have 2 packs from that last carton sitting on a shelf gathering dust.
    Tara and rockmoose like this.

  5. #5
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    I agree, use both if/while you need to. I don't agree with that part of the post. There are no hard and fast rules
    ......everyone is different. If you really want to stop smoking you will do it

    I totally get what you mean when you talk about the 'restless feeling'. I still struggle a bit with that to this day.

    Oh and welcome to AVF Dont hesitate to ask if you have any questions.
    emu likes this.

  6. #6
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    Hi Mr5o1 and welcome
    Everyone has their own quitting journey. Some quit tobacco instantaneously, others dual use for a while. In my case, I dual used for nearly 3 years, before I finally managed to quit tobacco.

    Success/Satisafaction about your journey is entirely up to you, and only for you to decide, and I would encourage you to focus on that, rather than other people’s definitions of success.

    With regard to the “restless feeling”, do a site search for WTAs - which are whole tobacco alkaloids - they are nicotine with some of the alkaloids that you are missing when vaping - definitely an additional kick to quitting tobacco, and you can wean yourself off them. I use Om Vapors.

    I needed to go full circle as far as kit was concerned. I started off with 1.80ohm Kanger coils in a basic kit, then got mesmerised by the whole sub ohm vaping thang. What got me off tobacco was going back to low watts, 0.6ohm coils in a Cubis tank, with a tight draw. Having said that, I do believe everyone has to experience their own journey through all of the options.

    Hope this help, cheers FX
    mallee00 likes this.

 

 

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